The experience of being an artist is a unique one but none so pronounced and pure as that of Sebastian Mullaert. Ever exploring the relationship between nature and creation, Mullaert examines his surroundings, his place within them as a human being, and transforms his musings into music. As a classically trained musician with an equally fascinating approach to music and life, Mullaert makes it known how he delivers his experience to others in his collaborations and intentions while producing musical masterpieces. The choice of media is carefully procured and arranged to address the end result which can vary depending upon the players and the feeling itself of the artist at that moment. To take a closer look into this world of live Electronic Dance Music and the utilization of gear and arrangement of it, I had the pleasure of meeting with Mullaert before his set at Cityfox Live 2020 to conduct an in-depth interview to find out more about his approach to music, his new album, and tour and why it’s important to find a common ground between classical and electronic instrumentation.
Hello, It’s RiMo at Fresh Music Freaks and I’m here today with the incomparable Swedish music producer and DJ Sebastian Mullaert. This (interview) is such a pleasure for me. I love live Electronic Dance Music and I feel like it’s another area that we’re going to see increasing in representation. I believe this is CityFox’s second year doing a live event and you as a veteran already with your own curation of live events for so long now, I’m sure it’s great to see this. The option of being able to use analog has changed. It’s more available to people. I remember (years ago) getting (electronic) equipment was very expensive. Not everybody could get that. Maybe you had a friend who had a great setup and you’d always want to go in there and play with their stuff. And they were like, “No, don’t touch that.” So, it’s kind of interesting to see how things have changed. Last year I attended Interzone and at the event, attendees got to create their own synth. It was fantastic and I thought to myself, you could never do this if it was ten, fifteen years ago. For many musicians, you couldn’t afford to create your own synths (set up). But now you can go online, find out how to make or purchase your own (gear and set up) and we have media and everybody has Ableton too.
I think there is the (hardware) side and then also the software side of things. In the 90s, it was only the hardware. And then so I think it’s really more accessible for people to try it. And if they like it then they can also take the step to go into hardware, but it’s not even needed to do that (any longer) because still explore with a computer and you can be eight years old and you can start to learn how a studio works. That was not possible 20 years ago. It was completely impossible.
And so with that thought in mind, I kind of believe that there is a possibility that we are going to see more live musicians. I mean, do you think because of that availability, do you think that’s going to increase the interest and perhaps more musicians will be going towards that direction when it comes to electronic music?
I’m very confident that’s the case. But I also think that electronic music has been more accessible to other musicians. In the past, it was more clearly people that are focused on electronic music. I’m doing electronic music today. We have people doing all kinds of other music and playing instruments. And on a parallel starting to investigate with electronic music and adding their acoustic instruments into that and adding their knowledge from that. So suddenly we have much more competence and musicality within the electronic scene as well because more people are looking in that direction.
I got inspired by you today and intimated to you some of my thoughts about this. You are a well accomplished classical musician, right?
When I was young, yes.
Well, I like to think it (classical music training) never leaves you.
No, certain things (don’t). But of course, there are also certain things you need to uphold and certain techniques. So when I play violin today I’m not at that level, which I was before because you need to play it all the time. And I obviously don’t have time to, to also do that and this and this, this and this. So I’m not on that level and more. But what I really feel like even when I play violin today, I feel that I in some ways (I am) so much more evolved. It’s more about the expression and the experience behind the playing, which I feel that I really learned in electronic music. And you know, especially in the kind of more alternative experimental side of electronic music where I kind of investigate it and experimented with the music. It was, the focus, was dance. The focus was to have an experience. And that’s where I kind of really got drawn and, and really got in love with the electronic music scene. The focus was not the artists, not the musicality and not the music itself. The focus was my interpretation of it and it was my dance in the music. Recognizing myself as an audience is an equally important part of the creative process as an artist. Including (the audience) in that way of seeing it (the creative process) was one of the really strong and unique things with electronic music creation in the past. I want to believe that it’s still there. So, (the audience element) was very relevant when I started to go out to raves and taking part in this scene.
Okay. And can you explain to me the relevance of inspiration from the music itself during the actual music creation process? Let’s say through the night when you’re performing that there is something in the music that goes ahead and inspires you to go in a specific direction. How do you incorporate that in your music as the night goes through?
First I would like to say that there are many ways of playing electronic music. Like everything else, electronic music in itself has many styles everything from the most obscure to the most commercial, to the most vocal. There’s so much within the electronic music today it’s hard to define us. When you play live and you can do it in many different ways and some people have the approach which is neither right or wrong, it’s just different ways of doing it. For some people, it is more like a concert. You have your planned songs and you play them like they should be heard and you perform that live within the certain interpretations of the night or the day whenever you play. But what I really have focused on and what I really love is the improvised side of things. For me, it’s quite a different approach or it comes from another intention and reason. I don’t want to play a song as good as possible. I don’t really care about that. I don’t want to, to play something that is already written. I want to like you said, be able to find and express what feels right and true right at that moment. So when you improvise, I think one of the beauties of that is that you can actually change everything on the fly. I have many different projects with different people and it makes it possible for me to actually tune in with another person and start to play with that. I don’t need to try to defend a certain sound or personality. I just try to play what feels right at that point.
I’ve always thought or assumed that an artist would be drawing inspiration from one or two sources. But your approach from what I’ve seen and listened to, it feels more like an integrated holistic journey where the artists and audience are acknowledging the role that the complete experience of self-awareness plays. Are meditation and reflection part of your journey as a performer? And would you say that this is one of the things that attracts so many fans to your music?
Meditation for sure is a big part of my life. It’s an important and amazing tool for people to get in touch with the living force within themselves as much as I think improvised music is. So in a way, I think improvisation and meditation are two very similar things because both of them are both and also something (a manner in which) you live. Meditation can in one aspect be a restricted thing that you do. It’s a certain time or you have a technique, but after a while, it’s being close to a meditative state where you’re acknowledging everything and you’re being very aware. And with improvisation, it’s the same because when you improvise you’re also very here. You react or you express something, you let out something that is happening right now. Quite naturally you design your life or your life gets designed in a way that you can actually approach it in that way (in the now). And also like when you play, if you really love to improvise, your studio starts to change. Lives start to change because you want to be able to be open to that. So you create that setting so you actually have that possibility.
I think that’s one of the things that as a fan we’re drawn to your music because it allows us to sometimes get to that meditative state. And music can be that vehicle that brings you to where you need to be.
The amazing thing with the dance culture is that it’s an active audience. When you are seated and you listen to something in a way it’s a much more challenging position as an audience because you have to sit down and it’s sometimes very hard to do that for a long time. You kinda get restless and your mind starts to scatter around. But when you dance it’s much easier to actually bypass that scenario and after while having an active body automatically awakens certain things in you. Endorphins and your focus awaken to the vibrations with the music automatically. It’s a very inclusive situation when you play for a dancing crowd.
I’m not quite sure whether to even talk about Tambor in the sense of using synths since it is experimental. I was curious if is there a very distinct quality to the tone or are there different styles of playing on your equipment that listeners may be unaware of that you have tried to emphasize as a musician?
No. When I play it, I try to be there and feel what feels right. That is my guide when I play, but that can be very different from place to place, audience to audience and stage to stage. I can’t design the sound or have a synth and expect that every sound system or monitor system I listen to on stage will play that in the same way. Sometimes it sounds very strange on stage and then when we improvise, you just have to accept that and play with that strange sound. I do the whole mix and I have to find some kind of passion in that sound at that time. When I listen to it afterward, this can sound very strange but you can’t really play with that thought that it should probably sound like that. If it’s right, I have to play it so it feels right when I play it. I have to adapt to the situation I’m in, which I think is the beauty of it.
You released your album “A Place Called. Inkonst” under Kontra-Musik in 2019 which you recorded at a live music venue in Malmo. This album is lovely with its transformative tracks lifting you into a realm of peace and connecting you with its creator (Mullaert). Can you please tell me a little bit about the electronic music scene in Malmo and its role in your music creation process?
Malmo was the place where I had a studio for almost ten years and it’s quite an important part of my electronic music adventure between 2000 and 2010. I moved there in 2000 and Inkonst was my home place to play. Ulf Eriksson from (Konstra Musik-SE) is an old friend and we’re also playing together there. It’s (Inkonst) a small town and warm community. And then I moved back out into the forest in 2010. I still play at Inkonst and tour but now I spend much more time with nature. I wasn’t doing that when I lived in Malmo because then I lived in a very urban situation. Inkonst is kind of the “Brooklyn” of North of Malmo. Inkonst has a lot of venues and restaurants. It’s very multicultural. It’s a lot of everything from mixed cultures, mixed demographic, and diverse occupations so the people are very diverse and it’s an interesting area to live on. That’s where I had my studio at that time. But then in the last ten years, I have come back to something that is very important for me. The whole concept about the album, which consists of many episodes, is about embracing that improvisational approach and see how does your expression change when the room you are in changes? How is your inner room changing depending on the outdoor room and is the outdoor room starting to change in your perception of it when you’re inner room changes? How is the creative expression changing that?
And so I was here for six weeks. I had my car coming from the forest, putting everything out and I recorded the whole album and 50 hours in addition to the album itself. I recorded so much music; I just pressed record and I improvised. And then, in the end, I choose certain parts. What I did was I put myself on the dance floor with the PA, so I heard it in the same way as an audience hear it when they go out to that venue. For me, it really makes sense to make music and hear it and feel it in a way that you imagine people would like to listen to it because the studio can also be a very secluded, perfect little place. I think before the project, I thought that the sound and that feeling of being straight in front of the PA would have the most impact on me.
But after listening to all of the takes and everything, I realized that it was kind of the whole urban situation that really changed me when they did it. I feel that compared to other music I did the last 10 years, that this album is a bit more melancholy, it’s quite urban. I feel the city and I could feel that because when you come from a national park where I live out in the forest and you come into the town the energy is different. There’s a lot of more people, people have a lot of more focus on determination and sometimes stress and even sadness. I even think the album was a little bit sad but not in a bad way, kind of a collective sadness somehow that I felt when I was recording it.
Can you tell me a little bit about the differences you experience when you play with a classical ensemble versus analog synths (electronic gear) and things like that rather than, you know, solo, outside of playing with an ensemble, what are the differences that you notice and that you’ve experienced?
Most of the people that I play with who are electronic musicians come from and very do it yourself, creative passion, attitude. It’s always been to kind of express your sound and do what you feel. Most of them are very, very connected and true to that. When it comes to musical instrumentalist and classically trained musicians to come to a level where you actually can work to have a chance at a position in an orchestra requires an insane amount of rehearsal. often it’s between 500 to 5,000 artists of playing/competing for that one chair position. All of them are quite amazing (artists). You have musicians that are so talented but they might not be able to spend the same amount of time as electronic musicians spend to enjoy the pleasure and the passion of why they do it (play). In one way it’s easier to be an electronic artist and often you can get away with being a bit lazier in certain aspects. And then, on the other hand, the classical musicians, when they finally come to a point where there are good, are living in a very secure place in that they have salaries. Most of my electronic music colleagues, if you don’t have a gig, you’re bankrupt.
Electronic musicians cannot start out following their passion and feel very free. Sooner or later that realize how fragile this place is as an artist. And then suddenly, later on, they get almost restricted because “I need to survive, I need to have a career, I need to do this gig.” They start to slowly slip away from the passion (for the music). And while on the classical side of things when people finally have a position, they can be a bit safer in that. In Sweden, we have a certain amount of writers that are state-funded. They have to have a salary for the rest of their life, paid by tax money and don’t need to write another book if they don’t want to. They have a fixed salary for the rest of their life. These kinds of things are also important because suddenly you have someone that because they are very talented and because of what they’ve done or acknowledged, they can work without any pressure of commercial interest and actually choose to write or do whatever they feel like. It feels right to them and they contribute to culture and art in that way.
So with all that said, I think an electronic musician or electronic music can easily trigger other artists in a way that they return to their passion. And that’s a little bit what I’ve done. For example, my Circle of Live project tried to set up a situation where I invite (artists) into improvisation and it’s extremely free (freeing) and without pressure. I want to give the artist the opportunity to return to a place to do whatever they want and play as little or as much as they want to. Most of the time people get very relaxed, positive triggered and they’re very close to that. So they suddenly become like YEAH! With classical musicians, I don’t have as much experience yet in doing this, but I think its due to the fact that I don’t have as many trigger points on how to get them going. And, of course, he’s also harder to find classically trained musicians that actually improvise. Not in jazz, but when it comes to classical music and like violin and cello, it’s a little bit less. Now I have the fortunate opportunity to play with an improvisational orchestra based on classically trained musicians. And they’re already doing that. It was quite easy to come to the point where we play together.
It’s a wonderful idea. I’ve seen that some musicians have a special bond with instruments. Do you have that or some sort of a special gear that you like to use where you have that bond with it in your work?
I have bonded with a lot of gear. As an electronic musician, you work in different places because you are also expressing different roles. You’re not the only alive musician, you’re not only a studio producer; you’re normally both. So in the studio, I have certain things that I work on all the time and it’s almost like an instrument, but I don’t have them on stage because it’s not possible to travel around with them. So what I have on stage is basically a smaller version in certain aspects of what I have in the studio. I’ve been trying to find in other ways or other kinds of gear to play in the same way. Mixers and loopers are what I use the most and I also use them a lot with my classical ensemble. I’m always set up so I can loop in anyone. The same with Circle of Live. I have it set so I can catch what someone else is playing and kind of start layering them and make them play on top of their own work. That’s also something I do with my own work. Sometimes I am looping my work and I layer on when I play solo. And then I loop that. Then I play something else on top and then I have all the different mixers and the all different loops and everything. Almost like an instrument, I start to play with all the different faders and create a loop or a mantra off of that.
I know you already mentioned Circle of Live and you know, for the purpose of the interview it’s a concept and execution of live electronic music, improvisational as well as experimental. Your Circle of Live project creates a platform for those inherent characteristics of electronic music. You spoke about the project and the collaborations it brings been for you and what role the setting plays in the overall experience. It’s very interesting that you told us about looping the music because clearly you are bringing many artists together as a curator, but it also seems like you’re inspiring new creations for them as well by helping them or by assisting them in the music creation process.
I think that one of the most important parts of that whole project is that it’s live music from start to end, similar to this festival (CityFox Live 2020). But COL is all improvised with no set plan and 30 is a group. Normally we are between three to five artists playing and there is no specific timeline between artists. So I tell them, you can’t come in any time you want and that you can show up for the last half hour if you like. I give them complete freedom to do as little as they want and also they don’t have to play with someone else. Depending on how an artist is feeling they may say, “I’m really angry today”, or express another emotion or feeling that they can use to identify themself as an artist.
Then an artist can create an image or reflection that they sent out then they get bookings and/or they get a fan base. Maybe someone buys an artist’s records and then there is a natural expectation that they will come with something and that can be very positive, but it can also be very limiting after a while if that is what everyone expects you to do. You can be expecting or think that they (fans) want you to do that and you kind of limit yourself because you expect yourself to do this in this situation and suddenly a few years you start to get really bored with what you do. I think for a lot of artists be an impossible situation. You don’t know how to get out of it because at the same time you can’t just stop them because you’re relying on that if it’s your bread and butter at the same time.
So Circle of Live, it’s completely free. So you have this place where artists don’t know who’s going to play what at what time. The audience doesn’t know who’s going to play when and in what constellation and how it will sound. And I think that’s a curiosity in a way. It’s also an expectation, but it’s an expectation that can’t really be met. Also how I designed it is that it’s always music playing before the audience comes. Someone always starts to play for an empty room. The first person that comes in as an audience sees that theirs already something happening with just one artist. Because doing this monster setups can also make people full of expectations. And I tried to break that down to the unit.
They (the audience) can’t know what’s happening and then suddenly I think the artist starts to feel that they don’t need to do this or that cause the audience doesn’t know what’s coming. As an artist, you can also hide behind other artists. If everyone is used to a specific sound from you, you don’t have to produce because there are more artists, so you can do something else. The whole setting helps artists to find, remember or let out something generating in themselves. It happens every organic and by itself. We should also think the same process also happens in the audience. Because that’s what I really believe is important is that we musicians and artists are on stage. What we do that has a big possibility to actually inspire a lot more people who are actually in the audience. And if we show that we dare to fail or do something we’re not used to because improvising like that it means that it’s not always perfect. By default, it will be very boring at times. I think the beauty of it is when you share something that is genuine and you are not afraid of sharing that and you are not afraid of failing. The people who take part in that journey, for example, the audience which is not only watching it, they are dancing and they are really in that whole creation.
And they suddenly feel that, wow, it’s quite amazing, it’s really beautiful when it is boring or it’s really beautiful when it’s quite bad and then becomes good. Most people following the whole journey probably don’t think about it, but I think when you feel that that organic way of life and how things move around, that is beautiful. Then you come back to your normal life that is also like that (beautiful). Normal life is not going to a concert and everything is epic and everything is perfect. You come to something and you feel magical not because of what you look at or what you listened to. The magic is the connection that you feel one with that and you feel that you recognize that, and it’s also inside of you. And, and I think then art, dance, and music can be something that’s encouraged and enrich people’s life.
The highly anticipated upcoming album that you made with the Tonhalle Orchestra called “Natthall” is due to be released on April 3rd, 2020. What was your inspiration behind this album?
The inspiration behind “Natthall” was really the opposite of “A Place Called.Inkost.” Natthall is actually a nature reserve close to where I live. The whole album, “Natthall” and that concert, includes a tour with another ensemble that is an improvisation ensemble. The Tonhalle Orchester Zürich is not an improvisation ensemble. I worked a score, they played it and I improvised on top. I made this album based on the recordings from that composition. I improvised in that kind of a postproduction way with all the music that was recorded. It’s really an honoring of nature and us, as part of nature. So that’s the greatest inspiration for that album.
You sent out the first track of your album so far and it is wonderful. So I, along with everyone else, can’t wait to hear the rest of the tracks. I just wanted to ask, is there anything else you would like to share with your fans, that you’d like them to know about your creative process?
I love to really focus on improvisation and also inspire people to allow that in their own life. I think of improvisation as an approach to everything in a way, but especially when it comes to art, music, and painting. Improvisation is for me the most pleasurable way of expressing something and you can’t really do wrong. Most people have some kind of creative relation to art and music in their life. You come to a point where you feel you don’t have so much time because of your profession, family, and work and then when you do come back to it (art) and you feel it’s not the same.
I’m not as good as before. And you kind of block yourself by measuring something with what it was before. But then if you allow yourself to improvise that is the most beautiful starting point to start to connect again with the beauty of the creative flow, which I think everyone needs. I think we are that and, and we need to come in contact with that as well.
For me when I’m close to that (improvisation), I’m much more friendly and happy. I don’t get bothered if someone goes before me in the queue. When there are phases in my life when I don’t get in contact with that or I don’t find the time to express and improvise, I feel that I’m more easily frustrated, irritated and getting into more fights with people around me. It’s just such a clear sign that we need to get out that as human beings and to be able to be more happy and balanced together. Even when you express something that is really angry and sad, it’s a perfect and very healthy place to get out of the emotions and instead of getting out these emotions in your relationship, so improvise more.
Well, thank you so much, Sebastian Mullaert. It’s been a pleasure speaking with you today and I can’t wait to see the show that’s coming up tonight.
Check out Sebastian Mullaert’s “Ascending Of A Spotless Bird” single from his upcoming album Natthall below:
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